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I certainly hope you're not working for them currently, because stepping into someone's virtual front room and calling them retarded, obsessed and ridiculous is certainly not the way to influence them to your way of thinking.
You have a great day.
I was already interested in getting a security system so doing a little more research fit into my already busy schedule naturally. So I researched everything I could... ADT, Brinks, Protection One, Online etc. What I found was that most companies were not offering the type of security I was interested in. Namely I didn't want a noise maker but I wanted something that would allow me, the user to see and control my home environment from remote locations. Of course very few offered such services because they are relatively new to the alarm industry.
So after my research I found there were few options close to what Firstline was offering me. In response to the post here I researched your prices from safemart and found a comparable package there for 542.95 and this was without the Smoke Detector included in my package as it wasn't an option that I could find on the website. I imagine 100+ dollars would be a fair estimation not to mention that I get an additional discount on my homeowners insurance with a monitored smoke detector. With of course the 24.95 monitoring over 36 months (Firstline's contract length) I figured roughly 900 Dollars not counting on "Free Months." 1442.95 is a little less than 200 dollars cheaper not including the additional homeowners discount and cost of the smoke detector. Even with everything looking to be about as dead even in pricing as possible I was left with one problem... I did not want to install or program the system myself, nor did I want to find anyone with no affiliation to the place I bought the equipment from to install the equipment. A lot of different potential problems I did not want to navigate. Also I was pleased to find out that I would not be receiving a Simon 3 Alarm system but a more aesthetically (not tough to do with the Simon) pleasing Simon XT. GE's new and unavailable to the public, except through two U.S. companies, version of the Simon.
Initially leery of the Door to Door presentation I have come full circle and feel great about the work done on securing my home. If you have enough time and resources to do it all yourself then by all means go to it. I have found that the 200 savings is not worth the hassle and headache of doing it yourself. It usually ends up costing much more in time and materials after it is all said and done.
Comparing Apples to Apples I can't agree with the part about selling over priced products door to door. The value is decent and the representatives were great and professional. I also liked the idea of buying from a college student and feeling that maybe his commission would reach the tuition office rather than too much draft at the local pub. Who knows right?
The pitch of free was never presented to me either... although I could understand how it could become that really quickly by a young person new to sales. Really though homeowners should be smart enough to know that nothing is free... every company researched was going to get their money for the service in one way or another. Although I did not research UNICEF... maybe they will be getting into home protection one day. Until then we are all going to have to pay something for the services provided. Perhaps a bad experience with them has affected the evaluation of their offers value? For my needs Firstline was the best bang for the buck.
Firstline is charging you $24.95/month for monitoring? Are you sure about that? The package my kid was selling was free hardware with $45.95/month monitoring. You're the first person I've heard of who is getting it for $24.95. Their website lists the price as $45.95, too. What monitoring do you get for that price?
The smoke detector was available on the second site I priced. I didn't include it because I didn't see it in the basic package that the Firstline folks sell. It's an add-on.
What Apples to Apples wrote was ambiguous at best, but even assuming your interpretation, I think it's just fine that they're satisfied.
I will, however, point out that the "free equipment" pitch is in the sales literature and the students are trained to use that approach to sell the product. The prices for the hardware now are less, so I still stand by my assessment that selling the product by offering 'free' hardware is deceptive.
This goes to what I've been saying from the start. If you have a product you can stand behind, why sell it with misleading statements? Why not just step up and say "here's what you can get it for online; here's what we charge for it altogether -- hardware and monitoring; and you get a professional installation"? Why the big deal about turning customers into advertisers with the frontline sign and the 'free hardware'.
The fact is that there has to be a margin to pay these kids for what they're doing, assuming they meet the threshold. Just like any other commissioned employee selling products cold, they have a right to earn a living for what they're doing.
If the product were unique, or the sales pitch straight-on, then I'd have no complaint. But this conversation began with Paul telling me that he did not feel he was being deceptive by approaching homeowners with a 'free offer' of a fully-installed security system with a required monitoring fee each month. That's deceptive. If he said that he was selling the system by approaching homeowners and telling them the hardware was amortized over 36 months along with the standard monitoring fee, I'd have far more respect for the pitch, frankly.
Why? Because that squares with what I can find on my own online. A comparable system with a comparable monitoring service for less money, but I self-install as opposed to paying for an installation. So then I make the decision based on whether I want to do my own installation instead of some bogus premise that I'm getting something for free.
Check very closely into what you are buying. Slomins, ADT and all the others are rip off artists as well. Good luck.
This was not the only outright lie, he also assured me that he had obtained the property owners permission before I allowed the install to be done. However, when I handed my landlord the homeowner's discount certificate he asked me , "what is this?" The landlord was NEVER contacted about his property being used as an advertising home or contacted by Firstline IN ANY WAY. I am in the process of obtaining a date for removal of the system and getting the run around from the cancellation department.
So what the rep really was saying when he/she said you wouldn't have to pay the monitoring fee was this:
Of course you have to pay the monitoring fee, but the insurance savings will more than cover it. And of course, it doesn't.
That rep was really dishonest with you. Most of them aren't. At least, not the ones who endeavor to be ethical...but they didn't sell all that many systems either, I'm afraid.
Good luck getting it taken out and refunded.
They tell me the alarm monitoring is covered by another company(ADT?) and I should complain to them. I said fine I will but I want out of the contract as they didnt fulfill their service and was never notified of a second party.
I was told too bad they are not liable and I am locked into 36 months. I tell them what the salesman told me and somehow they had him call me and he denied it and said I am locked into it. He also said he was a supervisor or such and his word was golden.
Was I lied too. Heck yeah. But I should have read the contract. Not that it would matter if they didnt follow on their end. As it lists so many outs for them that they could never be held accountable.
Really? Are you interested in slandering the company or evaluating your claims through sound research. It's not hard to understand what was being said in my post. The important thing is the bottom line... which you not myself is arguing. If the semantics are a big deal to you you then you should write a letter to all the companies giving out "free" cell phones while you are at it. While some sales tactics are unethical or dishonest we as consumers must shoulder a lot of the responsibility for knowing that the service will be paid for in one form or another.
Perhaps it would be different for me if I had a child that went and didn't like or do well at the job. My post was written in regards to the fact that you mentioned overpriced equipment without a really clear explanation of the costs to actually get the service Firstline offers. The other things I know nothing about. We are very happy with our system and the services.
As I explained to the rep, I am not the homeowner so how am I going to see a drop in the homeowners insurance?
To Michael the issue is not only the lie about monthly fees it is about them installing a system without the permission of the home owner.
Semantics are at the heart of this discussion. What you call something and how it's phrased are the key to the marketing pitch that Firstline and other companies use.
Just this weekend I received a flurry of flyers from DirectTV and Verizon, promising me "free and faster" equipment than I already had if I bundled my long distance, cable tv and phone service together.
Nothing is new under the sun. In fact, the prices are slightly higher than what I've got now, the equipment is different but not faster, and it's sold through a reseller rather than direct from the company.
You mentioned 'free' cell phones. Of course they're not free, not even when you walk in the store. They're 'free' after the rebate, the 12-month commitment, etc. The 'free' hook gets you in the store. In this day and age, I'd also view cell phones as a necessity, and further, they're something I am actually going to the store to buy, as opposed to opening my front door on a sunny morning to find a bright-eyed student there waiting to tell me what I really need is a security system that until now I've done just fine without.
This isn't about my kid -- this is about semantics. Telling people something is free when it isn't and training college students to sell it, using deceptive tactics is just the wrong approach.
BTW, you're given a platform here on my bandwidth at my expense to state your case, completely free of charge. Whenever someone finds this post, your point of view is represented, along with the views of others pro and con. If I were interested in slandering the company I would've closed comments and left the "semantic" part out of the mix.
The rep of course lied like a rug when confronted about not contacting landlord for approval. He never did answer the cancellation operator’s question of "did you actually speak to the landlord or did you leave a message?"
After it was obvious that the rep and I did not have anything further to say to each other, the rep asks to talk to the cancellation dept. privately. I am put on hold again and was then disconnected. Now I'm really pissed! I am calling back now and they better be ready to give me the address of their company attorney if they do not cancel this contract.
I'd suggest contacting the Better Business Bureau in your area and reporting it there.
Also, whether the rep answers the question or not, the fact remains that they do not have the homeowner's approval to install the system and so legally can't install it or bill the homeowner for it, as I understand things. (Keep in mind that rules for rentals vary from state to state, so what I said might not be true where you are).
And truly, from the comments here on my posts concerning firstline, it's not the reps I have the problem with for the most part. They're doing what they've been trained to do. It's the training that I take issue with.
I'll dare say that -Apples to Apples- is not a homeowner at all, but is rather, a Firstline employee.
As a former employee, it is apparent that this 'homeowner' has a very intimate knowlege of the inner workings of the company, accompanied with the same spin that many Firstline employees have.
What a great tactic, I believe successfull politicians are also implanting knowlegable staff to appear like innocent citizens.
The truth:
Many of my fellow coworkers used deceptive methods to sell systems. One rep told people there is a smoke detector in the panel. Another tells people that if they choose landline- rather than cellular- that the systems still sends signals even if the phone line is cut.
Rather than ensuring these poor people knew the truth, it was my job to ensure the homeowner didn't cancel. Imagine what I challenge I had when attempting to explain- a mini smoke detector, or worse, a cut phone line which can still comunicate.
And I do know that the cost of the system is added into the monthly 'monitoring rate.'
I'm shocked to see that the best reason to buy from Firstline, rather than a discount distributor is: the supposed 'professional installation.' Check out the reality here, and take time to look at the pictures of the 'professional installations.'
-Mike
Firstline: Your First Line of lies.
Josh, yes. I'm not inclined to want company employees monitoring those either. Frankly, I don't really want anyone monitoring my activity. I'll run the risk that someone makes off with my 'stuff' first.
Let's start with this:
First you said:
Take a look at the INC. 500. The INC. 500 is a list of the 500 fastest growing privately held companies in the United States and the 2007 list will be released nationwide on August 28th.
Then you said:
"I might even stay with a company that is listed on the INC. 500 and is staged to go public...either way, I am honest, straight-forward, and I will be successful at what I do because of my work ethic."
And tonight you say:
"First off, I never said we were previously on the INC. 500 list. I said we would be on the 2007 list on August 28th, 2007."
Um...since I've been accused in other comments of arguing semantics, let's just leave this one as a series of indirect statements which carried the implication that indeed, this was an Inc 500 company. Your middle statement in particular leads one to that conclusion, since you currently work for them and expect to be working for them in the future.
And you seem to agree with my point, which is that the Inc 500 is an indicator of rapid growth which yes, must be maintained over a period of time. Hence, the 'creative recruiting techniques' and equally 'creative sales techniques'.
Addressing your questions, one at a time:
You take isolated incidents, with select reps and blow them out of proportion. We have over 100,000 customers. You would think if all 2000 of us were running around being “deceptive” there would be a hellstorm of complaints and lawsuits. Yet, a blog that highlights isolated incidents and complains about how their kid got tricked into working hard is the only thing that shows up.
My response to you is two-pronged: a) Read the comments on all of my blog posts; and b) Read the links contained in those blog posts. Carefully. I am neither the first nor the last search result.
"Do you complain to a store manager when you find out that the “buy one get one free” special was not as “advertised”?"
Abso-frickin-lutely. If there is an advertised special that does not conform to what has been advertised, fine print included, you can bet the farm I do. I also don't do business with them. Typically, two for one offers involve technology which is on the way to obsolescence. Cell phones are an example of that. You want a Razr 2 for 1 special from Cingular/AT&T;? It's there, but the Razrs are a couple of generations back from the most current, sometimes incompatible with Cingular/AT&T;'s fastest wireless 3G network (but then, so is the iPhone), and you know that because you are in a store with all of the handsets right there to choose from. But you bet -- if something is advertised one way and that advertising is deceptive I'll be the first one to be calling the manager out on it. It's worth noting that Cingular/ATT gives the customer 15 days to rescind the contract, unlike the 3 days that Firstline gives.
If you go back into the archives of this blog, you'll find a series of posts that I wrote about an online advertising service -- PayPerPost. I wrote for them for awhile, despite the criticism that I was a whore for doing it. They set a price for the post, I decided if I wanted to write it, and if I did, I got paid. Simple as that. The blogosphere went nuts over it, claiming that PPP was corrupting the blogosphere with deceptive ads. And truly, some writers were deceptive in the beginning. Not all. However, I could point to the fact that I disclosed all of my paid posts up front, tagged them as such, and wrote darn good content for the money I was paid. Even though I don't write for them any more because of other conflicts and time issues, I believe in them as a disruptive, interesting, creative way to deliver advertising value.
The only thing that contradicted the assertion that all people who wrote for PPP were whores were the actual posts by all of us who disclosed and clearly displayed that disclosure.
Similarly, those of you who sell these units in a straightforward fashion have no criticism from me. I have defended those who sell when they've been criticized here on the blog.
But I will stand by my assertion that the marketing techniques taught to recruits are opaque and deceptive. You are free to disagree with that, and use my bandwidth to do it, and I will let it stand as long as you don't engage in personal attacks. (the comment at the top of this strand is pretty borderline as far as what I'll tolerate on my nickel). In that respect, any reader of this blog will have both perspectives to weigh and consider.
Which leads to my final point. Don't assume that because you go through the steps you outlined, everyone at Firstline does. They don't, and anecdotal evidence exists of that in the blog comments, consumer complaints and other articles on the web.
There is one point upon which we are in complete agreement:
"Bottom line, the consumer is responsible for himself/herself.
Yes, which is why I wrote this blog post and left it open for discussion. So they can make that 'informed' decision. Of course, to do that, they must tell the salesman they want to think about it and review the paperwork, which is utter anathema to the whole pitch. The idea is to pitch it, sell it on the impulse, close it, and then hope the customer wants to keep it in that three-day look time frame.
You definitely get the award for tenacity. I'm sure many of your summer's success stories can be traced back to that quality. All good luck to you.
I just spent the last three hours on AT&T;'s support forums for the Blackjack, after my email push client suddenly gave up the ghost. There were message threads 25 pages long filled with complaints. Now you could argue that given the size of AT&T;, that's not very many complaints when compared to the customer base. On the other hand, they follow the same theme right down to the overpriced data plans, erratic signals, and inconsistent performance. The law of numbers dictates that you can extrapolate a trend from that, since statistics prove that about 10% of customers will actually say something online while the other 90% lurk. Similarly, there are trends which can be extrapolated from the comments here and other negativity around the web. Is everyone dissatisfied? Of course not, or you wouldn't have a company to sell for. But the company itself would do well to consider what's been said here and elsewhere and modify their approach before the small outcries become much louder.
<h3>Random:</h3>
I had to remove your comment...I can't let you post the personal cell number of a Firstline executive on the site -- it's a disclosure of someone's personal information, which goes against the blog principles I have published here. Sorry.
Paying $45/month for a service I can get for $25/month is the ripoff part.
Had two college kids come by last week offering to sell their new Simon XT alarm system. I thought it was a good deal since I was told the alarm package would be free in exchange for the placement of the yard sign. The technician guy showed up minutes after signing the contract and it wasn't untill he had left that I came across this site.. The package total for the new Simon XT system came to $1595.00 and the monthly monitoring is $44.95 a month. I called the next day and had the technician guy remove the system. We then received a call from one of the college kids and he wanted to give us a month free and he also said sorry for the big hole in the wall left by the Technician and that the company does not cover holes in walls. We finally agreed to 2 free months.. the college kids came by the next day and had us sign a new contract because the Technician guy took the contract home.. dnt know why but the new contract had a total of $1685.00 for the alarm system..?? and also I just found out that they charged my card, $44.95 already!!
I don't think so. But thanks for stopping by.
It seems the bottom line is this: The product may or may not be good, the cost may or may not be competitive, but the marketing practices are misleading. As a consumer, it is my responsibility to decline this 'offer' and indicate that this type of marketing does not work. Alas, I may be only one voice in the wilderness, but I do what I can.
Marketing seems to be directed at convincing the public that we 'need' items that we had no thought to buy. And unfortunately when we do wish to make a purchase and wish information on the products available, we have to shift through volumes of data that seem intended to confuse rather than inform. Of course, the only way to stop these practices is to ignore them. As long these practices put money into the marketer’s pockets, they will continue.
You're welcome. I feel badly for the kids selling this system -- they're given a script and little else.
Juli:
Your bottom line is exactly the same as mine. This is what I've had such difficulty getting across to Paul and others in the comments.
The thing is, the majority of the kids who are recruited into this give it their heart and soul. They have goals, hopes, and financial obligations and when they figure out that they were sold a bill of goods which they were then expected to turn around and sell to others, it's incredibly disillusioning and costly.
You do realize that not all monitoring companies offer the same service right? That would explain the difference in price of your so-called rip off. As a Previous Tech Manager For Firstline I have set up security systems for 24.99, there are other options.
The latest price comes with some equipment and monitoring that has a lot of bells and whistles. It can't be compared to a self installed system and a run of the mill monitoring company. Most monitoring companies do not even have the technology to monitor the SimonXT.
Also, the pitch that Firstline uses is the same pitch all the other big alarm companies’ use. Put a sign up in the yard, pay our monitoring, and we will give you the system and installation for free. After paying the technician, sales rep, and equipment, along with shipping and all the other costs of running the company, Firstline will not start making a profit until halfway through the last year of the three year contract.
All the big security companies that do this are playing a game of averages, which is most customers’ stay with the same company for about 10 years. And the pitch that Firstline uses in its trainings is honest. The lies come from individual sales reps that twist it or add untruths. I my self have visited and had to admit to the customer that the sales rep had deceived them.
The potential for sales reps to deceive is a problem Firstline is aware of; this is why they have a conformation call. If the customer is paying attention they will catch some of these untruths. Still these problems are NOT the norm and Firstline as a company is always trying to improve on these matters.
read your contract, get into , its your reasponisablity to read the contract ask questions and look into. Your the adult , do the research so blaming a company who is trying to help you. And don't waste so much time complaning its no way to live your life.Its ridcoulous to see how much time you waste proving a point over a website.
If you actually read these comments you would see that the contract is produced after the product is sold. If you look at the sales materials, customers are not given a lot of opportunity to review the contract ahead of making an agreement. That's because they're counting on the impulse buy and the fact that remorse will set in after the three-day free look is past.
I figure if I spent 10 hours a month wasting the time of their employees on the phone then their losing money, Posting what bad information about them I can find is a bonus. If I can stop anyone else from making my mistake then they lose out on more money.
But if they break contract and wont man up and release me, I have no love for them and anything I can do is fair game, I'm sure thats their opinion as well.
A very brief power outage triggered an alarm about one week after installation of the system. That was when we learned that First Line provided an incorrect password to the monitoring company. That was fun. That was also when we learned that First Line did not provide the monitoring company with our 3 of the 5 alternate contact phone numbers we provided. Instead of calling my husband's cell or my work, they called my husband's sister because that was the only alternate number First Line gave them.
When the First Line sales rep came to my home I pointedly asked him about costs to terminate service prior to conclusion of the 3 year contract. He clearly answered that if I terminated service within 1 year it would be a $200 fee and if after 1 year but before 2 years of service, it would cost me $100.
After having the system in my home for 2.5 weeks and having 3 sensor problems and one false alarm I decided I wasn't up for it. I called First Line and asked to schedule an appointment to have the system removed. I felt that $200 was worth it. That was when the sales rep explained that I was responsible for payment of 75% of the contract value or approximately $700. I would need to pay the $700 first and could then schedule an appointment to have the system removed. I explained that the salesman had told me it would cost me only $200. He said he would contact my salesman and did provide me with my salesman's phone number so that I could call him as well.
When I called my salesman he explained that, of course, I would get a different story from the sales department - that's just business. I told him it wasn't the conduct of businesses I am used to dealing with. He went on to explain that he, as my personal salesman, could trump the quote provided by the sales department and could assure me that I would only have to pay the $200 to have the system removed and cancel service.
He called back within 5 minutes to say that, after checking with his supervisor, he could only guarantee that $200 fee if I gave him one more chance to fix things by scheduling a repair appointment with a particular service person. Feeling backed into a corner and faced with a $500 difference in costs to terminate service, I agreed to schedule one more service appointment. When I called to schedule the appointment, the earliest date I could get was more than 5 weeks out.
Summary - I wish I'd never signed up with First Line and would caution anyone else against doing so.
First of all, I'd really like to apologize to all of the people experiencing trouble with their alarm systems. I worked for Firstline from February until August of this summer.
Secondly, I would like to apologize to all of the people that I actively tried to recruit during the 'preseason'. You really can't recruit anyone without having at least tried something first...and now I'm paying the piper.
To all of the rather self-righteous employees who have posted on here about how everyone needs to quit complaining...I must say that your tone reflects the attitude of the company louder and prouder than any of your door approaches ever could. :)
I am not upset with Firstline Security, per se. I am more than a little aggravated at "The Prodigy"; a hip new reality TV show that doesn't exist. That's how I was recruited to work for Firstline. "Come out this summer, work hard, control your emotions, break through the learning curve, and you can be the CEO of your own company with $1 million in venture capital, a staff, a Hummer, etc..." I did not expect to win...but I did believe that I could have more money at the end of the summer than I had at the start. Trouble is, it's not a reality show at all...it's some internal company competition. It looked legitimate; there were sponsors, auditoriums, and pep rallies galore. Then the hammer dropped. That, my dear Firstline afficionados, is called 'deceptive marketing'.
I was enthusiastic about the hard work. I was happy about the concept of door-to-door sales. I was even ok with the total lack of pay and compensation for all of the recruiting I did during the spring.
I was not ok with all of the things that occured once I got to my summer location. Here is the short list:
-Firstline promises a short-term draw against future earnings so that you aren't totally broke while you learn the ropes. What they don't tell you is that you will be having most of that money deducted back for van rent and room rent. $250 - $150 = $100 a week...enjoy. :)
-Firstline has you on the books as a 1099 contractor. Then they tell you where to be, what to do, how long you WILL do it for, and impose penalties (sanctions) for any violations. They tried to tell me I couldn't claim workman's compensation for the gash I got in my leg as I ran from pitbulls and got caught on a spike on someone's fence. In other words...I was totally responsible. That seems to be a common theme coming from the company and the advocates who posted here earlier in the year. In other words, Firstline is totally irresponsible, and it's up to the consumer and the sales reps to do the responsible thing.
-Firstline purposefully recruits people from out of state. They will not recruit locals to fill in missing numbers. One common excuse may be that they are simply 'burning our bridges', as advocated in Napoleon Hill's "Think and Grow Rich". The truth is, they want to be able to fly by night.
FLY BY NIGHT: That's what my office did. I was in Central California this summer, up from Phoenix. After one particularly long, hot day, our regional VP showed up and told us that we were being shut down and relocated. Less than 24 hours later, we were gone. Again, I apologize to any and all who got burned in the crossfire of that exchange.
-Simon XT: I'm not certain which offices got those...or if they were just for the extension crowd, but most of us spent this summer slinging the Simon 3. It's not a bad system...the problem is that the upper management types at Firstline care less about providing services and more about making the INC. 500.
In fact, I am holding a copy of the INC magazine. It states in there that Firstline was projecting a total summer sales growth of 50,000 households. That's not a bad goal, unless you were recruited under the premise of "the average rep makes $20,000". In order to do that, one would need to hit 75 good credit installations. But, there are 2000 employees. Ok, so let's say that at least one third of those employees are technicians, office assistants, or upper level management. That leaves about 1300 sales reps. Divide 50,000 by 1,300 really quick. That actually is only about 39 sales per rep. Since Firstline is really awesome, that actually means the pay bracket is only $130 per deal X 39 deals = $5070 for the entire summer...and that's if you actually get good credits all the time AND collect activations from as many as humanly possible.
Another thing the Kool-Aid crowd won't tell you about is how many times the company policy changed about how they pay on accounts. A rep can sell and install 5 or 6 accounts in a week, and be left with about $150 to show for it after all of the nonsensical smoke clears.
How about the weeks everyone spent working from 9am until 9pm? And for what? To quote Wright Thurston, co-president of Firstline Security, it was "to give you guys more opportunity to break out of the learning curve." That was ok, the first time. The second and third times got to being a little upsetting...especially since $150 for a 72 hour week adds up to a total of $2.08 an hour. You could have made more working in an Indonesian sweat-shop. :) Go Firstline!
One last thing I would like to mention is that during the recruiting season, and during the recruitment lectures themselves, I couldn't help but notice all of the references to a movie called "Boiler Room". This is a movie about a dirty sales organization that creates a phony market to sell shares of non-existent companies to people via impulse. Know why so much mention of that movie is made during the lectures? Because Firstline Security of Orem, Utah, is in fact a boiler room.
Nobody mentions that these guys also charge employees for any parts that are 'given' to secure deals. I must explain this in depth.
In bulk, Firstline can get parts and bits of these systems, such as door/window sensors, for about fifty cents or less a piece. If a rep needs to over extend him or herself with a few extra pieces in order to get a deal, then those parts will ultimately be charged to the employee for the retail value. In the case of the door/window sensor, we're talking about $100 a piece. Do that often enough, and pretty soon reps will be owing Firstline money at the end of the summer...as stated by other reps in earlier posts. To boot, the company will then charge off all of their excess inventory as a tax write-off. Nice, huh?
And Paul...wake up and smell the roses. There is not going to be a public issue. It was all part of the sales pitch. They have no assets other than contracts that get auctioned off as soon as possible. A stock issue would bring too much unwanted attention to their operations and books. It's a chop shop. If you did well, and ended the summer with a positive balance in your bank account, you are the exception and not the rule.
-Sean
I didn't figure out that they had no official affiliation with GE until my existing system had been disabled and the new system was being installed. And... Guess what? They had no association with my existing security service either. As the installation was proceeding (and I hadn't even signed the contract yet) I turned on my computer and entered a Google query and... the first link I was presented was from RipoffReport. As the installation proceeded, I now knew this was a scam. I've posted my full experience on the RipoffReport website if you want more details.
But, everyone that is sharing bad experiences here needs to file a formal complaint with the Better Business Bureau (http://www.utah.bbb.org/). Also, find out who in your home state can help. In California, go to the Department of Consummer Affairs (http://dca.ca.gov/) and file a complaint.
I'm sure everyone posting here knows how unresponsive they are to all calls you make to them. As it stands right now, even though I wrote an e-mail to the company the day after the install, demanding to settle the misunderstandings or come and get the system, they still have gone ahead and are debiting my account. I never got to management within the cancellation period. The damn debacle even cost me an additional $200 to get my original system fixed/reinstalled!
This company is nothing but a shell that is taking advantage of everyone! Please, please, file formal complaints against them to save your neighbors the painful experience we've all been through.
And, previous "Advertising Directors" that have had less than stellar experiences, please continue blogging - especially where you go to school. The ramp-up for new hiring for next year is coming. Save others from what you were put through, or at least open their eyes to what they could be in for.
guy
Thank you guyhass for the information you listed as I will be taking action. I am currently waiting for my attorney to call regarding this. He has suggested suing First Line Security for Breach of Contract and falsifications. I will be speaking to him in length regarding this.
My son is a highly demanded web page designer and will be creating a webpage exposing the company and its fraudlent business actions with customers.
Also, my father and brother are both in the Sheriff's and Highway Patrol Departments and are spreading the word in Southern California about the fraudulent behavior and misrepresentation of First Line Security. This will also spread to city council members, so First Line will not be having much business here soon with the negative reputation and nagative publicity the company has projected.
Warning to others!!~!!! Heed this warning - First Line Security based out of Provo, Utah is a FRAUDULENT COMPANY! STAY AWAY!!!!!
Now, let's talk about billing.... our contract says "bill monthly" but we get billed when
SAI (their billing agent) gets around to it, and most often it's done incorrectly. In the first six months of service we have been over-charged by more than $209.00, and customer service is a joke! On three seperate occasions I have sat on hold for a cumlative total of an hour or more, and still no resolution. Think you have the right to cancel if they are screwing up? Think again, if one more of those self righteous "reps" tells me to "read my contract" I'm going to go section 8 on them! Ladies and gentlemen, please do read the contract (front and back) it's two legal size sheets in very small print, and you pretty much waive your legal rights. DO NOT ALLOW THEM TO INSTALL ON THE FIRST VISIT. Let them leave the paperwork so you have time to really read it, no matter which alarm company it is. As for us, two and half more years in our "contract", and you best believe I'm sending the 60 day cancellation notice by certified mail - and most likely about six months in advance so there is no mis-understanding of our intent to stop service!
This company is a sham!!!
Bottom line: Firstline Security = first rate ripoff
You're the second person to say that Firstline has gone out of business, but I can't find anything in the news, business or legal areas that confirm that. Do you have a supporting link or is this rumor, especially given that you're working for a competitor.
They have been operating in the red since inception and owners have literally squandered all borrowed funds /revenues. They went from going on cruises every month and "the fastest growing home security co in the galaxy" to upside down and under water. CLASSIC!!!
I'm sad for the folks who won't receive the payments they expect to receive on 2/1 -- the final 'backend' pay. And it's not even payroll, so won't have priority like the others at the service center, because they were all 'independent contractors'.
Grrr.
so i'm supposed to feel sorry for the employees that knew that the whole firstline security business was a pyramid scheme, a sham, but continued to be part of it? sorry, no sympathy here! i agree with you 100% that the duo, the founders that dreamed up this scheme should get their fair dues. they certainly are scum! but it sounds like as if all of their cohorts were fine with ripping of old retired folks all over the country as long as they received a paycheck. all anyone working for firstline security had to do was google for "firstline security" and up would come all of the horrible examples of what was being done. any employee could have talked with anyone answering the 866-434-7785 number and i'm sure you would have heard horror stories. i had two encounters with employees that answered the phone. on my second call, for the first time in my life, i swore at the person. i was that upset. i immediately apologized, but that's how bad it got! everyone that took a paycheck from firstline security that knew the pain and suffering that was being inflicted on the innocent public by the company's tactics - i hope you all learned a lesson; sorry that it had to such a hard one... but if you only knew the mental anguish i went through... sorry, no sympathy here...
thx
There was a website, but it appears to have been taken down. It was there a week ago, so I'm guessing it was pulled down as part of their bankruptcy proceedings.
The folks who worked for Firstline thought they were selling a good product. I think blaming them really gives a pass to the folks at the top who not only deceived customers, but also employees.
At the time I wrote this post, there were only two posts on the Internet that were negative. I couldn't find any articles in the mainstream press or anything that came up on a Google search. That's one of the reasons I wrote it...to warn off other kids who might have been sucked in by the scam.
I agree, no argument. But keep in mind, they wrote those back in late August, when there was no indication that the company was going bankrupt. I doubt there would be too many defending it at this point, though I have had a few on an earlier post of mine.
You have the best collection of info on Firstline on the entire web. I was an employee last summer, but I did my best to be honest and up front with my customers; I guess thats why I wasn't a super star with 200 accounts. I feel like I too was lied to looking back on it all.
So as far as everything you've put on here, about the upper management and *some* of the employees you are spot on.
Im concerned now about us getting out Tax info back. I received my W2 from my current employer last weekend but still haven't gotten anything from Firstline. When my manager (who I am still friends with and is one of the good FLS employees) told me that they went under I first felt bad but if it is true that Trevor and Wright pocketed millions each then I hope they get busted. So my question to any Firstline former higher ups (Jake Dahl if you read this) do you know when we are supposed to receive our Tax info from last summer?
Anyways keep the conversation going about these type of companies and the real risks vs reward that is involved. Firstline is not the first to fail at it and there are plenty of others out there.
1. They sell a contract to you for lets say 40 dollars a month and they give you the equipment (more like rent it to you, check your contract if you cancel before the end of the contract) for free.
2. After selling you the contract their initial cost of equipment is lets say 300-500 dollars depending on their manufacturers or equipment distributors.. ex) Honeywell, GE... This is their upfront cost.
3. Over the price of the contract they will make 300-500 dollars minus the total amount you pay at the end of the 36-60 month contract.
4. To make these contracts more liquid or get money for them quickly they will sell these contracts to monitoring station or companies. You are not being monitored by Firstline or hardly any other security company. They sell either out right sell these contracts to monitoring stations (ex) Monitronics, SAI etc... ) or they will rent out some of these monitoring stations per customer which is much cheaper than the rate of 40 dollars a month it is more like 2.25-5 dollars per customer. So if the security company can in fact front the initial cost they will keep you "in house" and rent you out sort of speak.
5. They will sell some contracts for the full contract value to the monitoring stations because statistically if you have a security system you will stay longer than the 36-60 month contract thus they start making money on you after the length of your contract. If you are kept in house the security company will start making money on you about a year and a half into the contract length because they will have covered their equipment costs. But that is not taking into account paying a sales rep and an installer. So they will start to make money at the end of the contract length and they have statistic proof that you as a customer will stay longer than the contract length.
6. The problem with selling or renting you to a monitoring station is that if they don't get the information correct your system could go off and then if no one calls you know you are not being monitored and the police are not on their way. A small bit of advice to anyone is to make the alarm go off and see if someone calls if someone does then you are in good shape... If not then you are not being monitored. Good luck in this rat race. It is an industry of cut throat sales and marketing.... Good luck consumer and do your homework. So instead of doing the security industry I decided to go into network marketing http://oneyearplan.net/payitforward/
This is better information and will protect you far greater than a security system in the world of a falling economies etc...
Platinum security is a spin off of regional reps. from APX security that took off and started their own company. They did really well last season. Very well from what I heard. They would probably hire anyone with any security or summer sales experience. So the claim that they have no former FLS employees could or couldn't be true you never know.