What a complete scam. Laura is signed up with Career Builder and I think she may have got a solicitation from this company or something like it.
We get a lot of door to door sales people at my office, which is on a mixed residential/commerical street. They're selling everything from cheap toys to truckloads of furniture "just in from North Carolina" that was "supposed to go to a store in Chicago but was overstocked." Or some line like that. The people doing the selling are all about 18 to 30 and looking very desperate. This has to be one of the hardest ways to make a living.
Liz
· 2 years ago
Karoli,
I'm at a Best Western in Pacific Grove with free, but wonky internet. Keep checking back on the post because I'm updating as I go.
karoli
· 2 years ago
Marie,
It's horrible. For the past eight weeks I've been trying to be encouraging thinking he really was working toward a real goal, but after reading Liz' post tonight I called him and told him to bail out, come home and to go from there. He's broke, tired, pissed and feels stupid. The first and last one of those are things I can help with..the middle two will just take some time, I think.
Anon
· 2 years ago
The Prodigy is a real concept designed to help an entreprenuer that has the skill set to be extremely successful at something that not many people would even attempt. There is a million dollars of venture capital waiting for the winner of the program. If the show will be aired, that is another question. From what I understand, it is very difficult to get a tv show picked up.
I don't disagree that there was probably a financial motive for creating the show and bringing in more recruits. But aren't all reality shows created to create an ROI? That is what free capitalism is all about.
karoli
· 2 years ago
Anon,
The key word in your comment above is "concept". That's not how it's being marketed. It's being marketed as a done deal -- a show that is really being done, that's really being aired, and that the focus of the time spent with Firstline is toward the goal of being the next Prodigy.
In fact, the show is secondary to the idea of recruiting direct sales marketers for the Firstline products. Having read through all of the paperwork connected with it last night, I'm more convinced than ever that the show is just that -- a concept. Firstline has been using college students as direct sellers for a few years and the only difference this year is how they were recruited - with the promise of the pie in the sky.
Is it fair to put some responsibility on the students that bought into the allure of the reality show premise? Maybe, although I looked hard at this whole thing back in April and May when the 'auditions' were held, and it seemed at the time to be legit. At least, there wasn't a lot of information available about it or whether it was a straight operation until after they signed on the dotted line.
I suspect this tactic will not work as well next year.
Anon
· 2 years ago
Karoli-
The show IS being done, filmed, produced. Whether it hits the air or not is another question. I don't even work there anymore, so I don't have the inside informaion. But the goal still remains, 1 Million dollars to the winner. This is not contingent upon the airing of the show. There will be a Prodigy and whether this works as well next year, I don't know and don't much care. Bottom line, the company and the opportunity opened up amazing opportunities for me and can do the same for any individual with the right skill-set and work ethics.
karoli
· 2 years ago
Anon #6, I'm curious. How long have you worked for Firstline? Did you sign on as part of the Prodigy promotion?
Anon
· 2 years ago
I worked for Firstline for almost 5 years. I joined on after the first summer the company was in business and left to manage my own marketing company a short time ago. No, I was not hired on as part of The Prodigy promotion.
karoli
· 2 years ago
Anon,
As I've remarked on other posts, there is a vast difference between the environment and market today and five years ago.
As I said in my post, I've no doubt that recruits and graduates from Firstline emerge as great salesmen. But the market today is very, very different, and the sales tactics taught now reflect the difficulties of the market.
I suspect that five years ago you signed on knowing you were going to be selling security systems door to door. The Prodigy recruits were not of the same understanding until they had gone past the "second audition" and were told with much fanfare that they'd made it to the show.
With that said, congratulations on being one of the group that enjoyed success and continuing success.
Frances Haim
· 2 years ago
My 20year old Australian son went with his mates to America for a holiday and was recruited by these people. He has spent $15,0000 of his savings to get to America to walk around the streets selling. They kept at him, making phone calls to Aust and helped him organise his visa which also cost him a fortune. I worry every day for him especially with the Mormon issue as they seem to have influenced him a lot. I really want him home and feel sad that all his hard earned money will be lost and he will be deflated and unhappy. He has so much talent and doesn't need these people.He was doing so well in Australia with his acting and singing and they just had to be there when he was on campus!
Tyson
· 2 years ago
I know of this company and I know that their tactics ar evil, but there is a good way of making great money in the summer for good door to door summer sales program, Alarm systems just isn't the way. As far as I can tell they (alarm companies) all lie. An honost door to door summer sales can be found at www.teamami.com
You talk people into saving money on their garbage service instead of lying in order to sell people a luxery product (home securities).
They also don't lie about housing and other bonuses with quotas and the like.
Tyson
Nate
· 2 years ago
I worked for firstline last year and at the end of the summer got a check for roughly $15,000. Not the 6 figure number that people throw around but I went out and worked hard and really tried to learn how to sale door to door. I feel I learned a lot this summer. I lived with kids that didnt' do as well but i also knew a lot more kids that made a lot more money than I did, but it was very clear to me what was in the contract and what was expected of me. Its a risk to leave everything behind and relying on door to door sales. Everything is based on commission but if you learn how to sale and work hard you can make money. Its funny how no one talks about the thousands of college kids that actually go out with these "summer sales" companies and end up making a lot of money. Only the sqeaky wheel gets heard and hopefully oiled. No one hears about the success stories. I was honest in my sales and felt that a security system was a reasonable thing to own in the area I was woking. I saw some salesman lie and use other tactics and some ended up making more money than me. I know that there is shady practices in this industry but for the majority they are legitimate companies and really pay out what they promise but kids need to read the fine print. In most cases I blame the individual who didn't pay attention to the contract. I also met the son of the person from Australia. Aust I think was his name. He's a great kid and is having a lot of success. He will be rewarded nicely. I was at a dinner with him and the owner (Wright Thurston) and several other managers. They are taking care of your son, well I should say he is taking care of himself by producing sales.
ExEmployee
· 2 years ago
I've worked for this company for about 4 years. The company does lead people on when they hire them. They do talk about how much one can make in only four months. One thing to make clear is that people in the company (including first year representatives) can and do make quite a bit of money. I was recruited into firstline when one of my friends came back from his first summer with them and had made over 80,000 in the four months plus the extension program they offered (usually a 6 week period after the contracted four months). I would venture to say that only 10% (if that) actually succeed to the average level that is touted to the recruit. 10% is hardly average. About the prodigy... I remember when they rolled the idea out to the company on the end of year cruise. It isn't so much a scam, but it is. It's primary goal was to produce massive amounts of recruits. Recruits make the company and it's managers money for each and every sale made, whether it be one sale or 300. Don't get me wrong, someone will be named the prodigy and will win a car and money, but that isn't why they came up with this whole reality show concept. It's a ploy to gather recruits. If it works only one year, it still worked. If it works and gets on TV, it'll only cause more unsuspecting people to sign on and most likely fail. When I say the people will fail, it's not that the company doesn't want them to succeed, it's that they place sooooo much intensity into recruiting that they neglect training which leads to sales reps not knowing much and they resort to lying to the customer to cover their insecurities about what their doing. Also, to the person who plugged their trash sales company stating that all security companies lie... they do, but I hope you have a better pitch to gather recruits than bad mouthing other companies to make yours look better. Anyway, I've since left the company. The main reason I left is that it's run by college aged people. Entirely. The owners of the company are no older than 32 years old. We did have some people that were hired to be CEO or CFO or something like that that were more mature (late 40's or 50's) and have since left the company. The company has great ideas if implemented well and trained on properly. I don't believe this company will ever attain the status it desires because honesty and dishonesty are equally rewarded, as long as the sales come in. It's getting a little late and I can't think well anymore, but i'll come back and read what i've posted and update anything I feel i've left out, if you have any questions please ask.
pest guy
· 2 years ago
Take it from me I am a veteran with 10 years selling pest control on the doors!!! The problem listed above is simple, over recruiting. When I started, nobody had heard of the job. I took the calculated risk to go to CA and find out if my friend's experience was realistic. I figured if it didn't work, my parent's home in Oregon was just a few miles a way. The job was hard but I had success. I made 26000 in 1998. The next year it was double. 10 years later, sales are still good but recruiting stinks. As the alarm companies came on the scene a few years ago, recruiting became intense. To compete you could no longer present a 15000 dollar summer as being a good experience. With nothing to compare, recruits flocked to the recruiters who promised more. 4 years ago, my wife and I were leaving Target and Jared Tagert of Firstline approached me in his Escalade. He asked what I was doing for summer work and I told him that I sell pest control and have a small marketing company. He looked at my 4 year old Jeep Grand Cherokee with a look of "that is what you drive" like you obviously aren't doing well. They sell materialism and use the flash to disguise the over promises. From that point on, the industry has become a lie. I have a friend who works in alarms who just took out loans on a Dodge Viper and Hummer. To compete you have to flash the cash. As the industry continues to over promise its way to recruiting goals, more and more salesman are hired that should never have gone into it. I used to be able to recruit 20 guys and all but one or two would finish the summer. Now, finding 20 guys that haven't been over promised by at least 5 other companies is impossible. As we all reach out for my reps, we are taking guys who don't belong in a job like this. Before you or anyone you care about goes out to sell, follow this guideline. 1.Upfront pay-the higher %upfront, the less the company can possibly steal from you later. The $$ you make per account doesn't matter if you don't get it upfront. You will have no way to make them pay you later. 2. Expenses- summer bonuses are a marketing inside way of making it look like you will make money that you will never see. Live on a budget and calculate the real cost. Driving to Michigan isn't cheap. 3. The product- alarms have to sell ghettos. It is selling insecurity that works best. Pest control is good in buggy parts of the country and bugs don't only run in bad areas. I sold all summer in Southern California to homes always valued at over half a million. 4. Direction and training. Find someone who can make your individual experince count. Don't fall prey to the fancy cars and idle talk. What is typical, achievable, and realistic. Above all, talk to others that aren't on the payroll about their experience. Good luck
Theo
· 1 year ago
I appreciate what the Pest Guy had to say. It was about the same time when my brother first worked for a Pest Control company. He was being offered a job back home that paid $12.50 per hour, and walked away from that to experience selling Pest Control...walking away from the summer earning over $30K his first year. But that was a different era, the one before the dark age of Alarms. These alarm companies are ruining the market by all their deceit and overpromising. To understand the motivation, you need to see all the pieces... 1. The Actual Alarm company hires a marketing company like Firstline to get them new accounts. To understand that the Alarm company can monitor 10's of thousands of people with a small monitoring office, and all those customers are paying $30 to $40 per month, it is easy to see why the Alarm company would pay Firstline $2000 per account. 2. The less a sales rep sells, the less of this $2000 that Firstline needs to pay out based on their payscale. It would be in their best interest to hire twice as many people per office who sell 1/2 as much as promised, thus helping Firstline keep more of their $2000 commission from the actual alarm company. Even their experienced sales reps typically only earn $500 per sale, making it easy to see why corporate people can flash their money so abundantly. As firstline corporate people truely earn crazy money off the backs of the masses, they invest in full-page color advertising, recruiting buildings that show off their 'success' that include swimming pools, video games, lounges, pool tables, everything you can imagine to get people to buy in to their mirage of success that awaits the un-knowing victim. 3. Due to the managers being paid really well, they flash their new cars and talk about how much money they made, and lure the unsuspecting victim to their fate. Some will earn good money, but the majority will end up hating summer sales forever, even though there are real honest opportunities for them to earn $15K+...just like the good ole days.
There are plenty of good summer opportunities, which if you follow the advice mentioned from 'pest guy' you can avoid the natural pitfalls that can effet your experience. Pest Control is a great opportunity, as is 'Garbage', which is my industry. We have been in business for 7 years, and have a great niche in the summer job industry saving people money on their subscription garbage service. Garbage is a service that everyone needs, and our whole 'sale' is switching them to another company to save them money. Alarms is not a necessary/essencial service, and people can usually live their entire lives without it, unlike garbage. Everyone needs a garage service, especially if the city doesn't provide it. Ask people at Firstline how many people use their own product and I'm sure you won't find a soul. If people have bugs, they need pest control. If people want to watch TV, they can choose from Cable and Dish. But the bottom line is Alarms are a luxury item that people who don't live in harder parts of town don't need...unless someone comes to their door to tell them that their live is in danger unless you buy their product...Firstline
Stay away, far away. That goes for all Alarm marketing companies, not just Firstline.
Theo
· 1 year ago
A follow-up to ExEmployee...
My brother didn't expand on his feelings, but the fact is we both work with students every year, and the commom thread we hear from them is how agressive these Alarm companies recruit, how they plan on hiring 30 guys because they know only 15 will stick it out, how they promise $40K to $100K for the average guy (and who doesn't think they are at least average) to get people to commit, and how many of the students end up owing the company money at the end of the summer. Students are afraid that everyone is out to get them, and that summer sales is a big scam. It is not. It is a great way for a student to earn money and expand their horizons. I promote people working for any major industry except Alarms. Do not reward them for their techniques. Sell Pest Control, Dish, Cable, Garbage...whatever...just not Alarms.
pest guy
· 1 year ago
Just thought I would let everyone know. I believe Firstline went out of business. As did Atlas Security. They had trouble reselling the accounts they got this summer. Since there is a heavy upfront cost and it requires a lot to monitor your own systems, word is they are out. I believe most of their main guys are off to APX and Pinnacle. I am friends with one of the top reps at Firstline. They owe him big money. I wonder if he will get paid? What is your guess?
Jared D
· 7 months ago
Your comments are true. "The Prodigy" was just a recruiting ploy, to my knowledge it was never ever aired. While is sounds like your son didn't have a great experience, some people really do have good experiences spending their summer knocking doors.
Personally, I have done it for 5 summers. Summer sales has provided me the opportunity to pay for school and learn valuable skills, plus it has introduced me to other students who are highly motivated and have similar goals.
Because summer sales was so good to me. I started a website, http://www.SummerSales.org, that outlines the pros and cons of each sales industry and allows students to get a real glimpse into what selling is like before they make a decision. Plus, my website introduces students to trustworthy companies to work with, there isn't a company on my site, Alarm, Pest Control, Trash, Home Services, or otherwise that I wouldn't feel comfortable working for, or referring my best friends to work for.
All the negative comments about Firstline and The Prodigy are/were true. I was intimately involved with the Prodigy from a production standpoint and can affirm that even we were duped. Coming from a film/television background I knew what to expect for a true production and expected as much and was sorely disappointed. Nevertheless I stuck through with it.
During the last phase, when 3 contestants were left, the actual "Prodigy" (the winner) was selected, not because of his performance in the challenges leading up the grand finale, but because he'd been coached and maneuvered into that position. He had been preselected to win The Prodigy based on his previous 3 years of sales performances. One of the videographers during this phase even caught on tape during the judging, one of the judges (a firstline owner) commenting "How are we going to make it look like [the Prodigy] won, because frankly his business plan (the final challenge) sucks. [Contestant #2's] was much better."
I had no doubts this project would fail from the beginning, but I was receiving a paycheck. As shaming as that may sound. The "weekly contests" were a joke. Unquantifiable and incomplete-able. One such "challenge" was to get rid of one bad-habit for the week. Another such challenge was to have a positive attitude. Nothing was measured, nothing tracked.
I feel sorry for all the people duped into thinking this was their shot to stardom. That they would be on TV, noticed nationally and receive a great reward. Thinking they were on an actual reality show which was nothing more than a recruiting scam. I realize the story is more than dead at this point, but wanted to add my two cents.
All Comments
We get a lot of door to door sales people at my office, which is on a mixed residential/commerical street. They're selling everything from cheap toys to truckloads of furniture "just in from North Carolina" that was "supposed to go to a store in Chicago but was overstocked." Or some line like that. The people doing the selling are all about 18 to 30 and looking very desperate. This has to be one of the hardest ways to make a living.
I'm at a Best Western in Pacific Grove with free, but wonky internet. Keep checking back on the post because I'm updating as I go.
It's horrible. For the past eight weeks I've been trying to be encouraging thinking he really was working toward a real goal, but after reading Liz' post tonight I called him and told him to bail out, come home and to go from there. He's broke, tired, pissed and feels stupid. The first and last one of those are things I can help with..the middle two will just take some time, I think.
I don't disagree that there was probably a financial motive for creating the show and bringing in more recruits. But aren't all reality shows created to create an ROI? That is what free capitalism is all about.
The key word in your comment above is "concept". That's not how it's being marketed. It's being marketed as a done deal -- a show that is really being done, that's really being aired, and that the focus of the time spent with Firstline is toward the goal of being the next Prodigy.
In fact, the show is secondary to the idea of recruiting direct sales marketers for the Firstline products. Having read through all of the paperwork connected with it last night, I'm more convinced than ever that the show is just that -- a concept. Firstline has been using college students as direct sellers for a few years and the only difference this year is how they were recruited - with the promise of the pie in the sky.
Is it fair to put some responsibility on the students that bought into the allure of the reality show premise? Maybe, although I looked hard at this whole thing back in April and May when the 'auditions' were held, and it seemed at the time to be legit. At least, there wasn't a lot of information available about it or whether it was a straight operation until after they signed on the dotted line.
I suspect this tactic will not work as well next year.
The show IS being done, filmed, produced. Whether it hits the air or not is another question. I don't even work there anymore, so I don't have the inside informaion. But the goal still remains, 1 Million dollars to the winner. This is not contingent upon the airing of the show. There will be a Prodigy and whether this works as well next year, I don't know and don't much care. Bottom line, the company and the opportunity opened up amazing opportunities for me and can do the same for any individual with the right skill-set and work ethics.
As I've remarked on other posts, there is a vast difference between the environment and market today and five years ago.
As I said in my post, I've no doubt that recruits and graduates from Firstline emerge as great salesmen. But the market today is very, very different, and the sales tactics taught now reflect the difficulties of the market.
Here's another first-hand account of how Firstline is marketed (and installed) today.
I suspect that five years ago you signed on knowing you were going to be selling security systems door to door. The Prodigy recruits were not of the same understanding until they had gone past the "second audition" and were told with much fanfare that they'd made it to the show.
With that said, congratulations on being one of the group that enjoyed success and continuing success.
You talk people into saving money on their garbage service instead of lying in order to sell people a luxery product (home securities).
They also don't lie about housing and other bonuses with quotas and the like.
Tyson
There are plenty of good summer opportunities, which if you follow the advice mentioned from 'pest guy' you can avoid the natural pitfalls that can effet your experience. Pest Control is a great opportunity, as is 'Garbage', which is my industry. We have been in business for 7 years, and have a great niche in the summer job industry saving people money on their subscription garbage service. Garbage is a service that everyone needs, and our whole 'sale' is switching them to another company to save them money. Alarms is not a necessary/essencial service, and people can usually live their entire lives without it, unlike garbage. Everyone needs a garage service, especially if the city doesn't provide it. Ask people at Firstline how many people use their own product and I'm sure you won't find a soul. If people have bugs, they need pest control. If people want to watch TV, they can choose from Cable and Dish. But the bottom line is Alarms are a luxury item that people who don't live in harder parts of town don't need...unless someone comes to their door to tell them that their live is in danger unless you buy their product...Firstline
Stay away, far away. That goes for all Alarm marketing companies, not just Firstline.
My brother didn't expand on his feelings, but the fact is we both work with students every year, and the commom thread we hear from them is how agressive these Alarm companies recruit, how they plan on hiring 30 guys because they know only 15 will stick it out, how they promise $40K to $100K for the average guy (and who doesn't think they are at least average) to get people to commit, and how many of the students end up owing the company money at the end of the summer. Students are afraid that everyone is out to get them, and that summer sales is a big scam. It is not. It is a great way for a student to earn money and expand their horizons. I promote people working for any major industry except Alarms. Do not reward them for their techniques. Sell Pest Control, Dish, Cable, Garbage...whatever...just not Alarms.
Personally, I have done it for 5 summers. Summer sales has provided me the opportunity to pay for school and learn valuable skills, plus it has introduced me to other students who are highly motivated and have similar goals.
Because summer sales was so good to me. I started a website, http://www.SummerSales.org, that outlines the pros and cons of each sales industry and allows students to get a real glimpse into what selling is like before they make a decision. Plus, my website introduces students to trustworthy companies to work with, there isn't a company on my site, Alarm, Pest Control, Trash, Home Services, or otherwise that I wouldn't feel comfortable working for, or referring my best friends to work for.
See for yourself. http://www.SummerSales.org
During the last phase, when 3 contestants were left, the actual "Prodigy" (the winner) was selected, not because of his performance in the challenges leading up the grand finale, but because he'd been coached and maneuvered into that position. He had been preselected to win The Prodigy based on his previous 3 years of sales performances. One of the videographers during this phase even caught on tape during the judging, one of the judges (a firstline owner) commenting "How are we going to make it look like [the Prodigy] won, because frankly his business plan (the final challenge) sucks. [Contestant #2's] was much better."
I had no doubts this project would fail from the beginning, but I was receiving a paycheck. As shaming as that may sound. The "weekly contests" were a joke. Unquantifiable and incomplete-able. One such "challenge" was to get rid of one bad-habit for the week. Another such challenge was to have a positive attitude. Nothing was measured, nothing tracked.
I feel sorry for all the people duped into thinking this was their shot to stardom. That they would be on TV, noticed nationally and receive a great reward. Thinking they were on an actual reality show which was nothing more than a recruiting scam. I realize the story is more than dead at this point, but wanted to add my two cents.