I COMPLETELY agree with you. All three of my children are boys; my oldest is 16. He could be the poster child for these articles. A child who could write his name at age 2, read three years ahead of his age, suddenly became "dumb" with ADHD in 5th grade. We constantly struggled with teachers and administrators. Last week we decided to go the GED route. Since then my son has not had any anxiety attacks, is far less angry, and generally happier.
I have twin boys who are 8 yo, and one of them is exactly the same as the oldest. My dream would be to be able to stay at home and teach them myself, but that it impossible. I will continue searching for resources to help him through this new academic hell.
drumsnwhistles
· 3 years ago
Hi Heather and welcome!
I'm sorry to hear you're having these struggles...my heart is right there with you. And like you, there is no way I could homeschool -- I used to really wish I could have in the earlier years.
I hope your son isn't so completely sour on learning that he gives up on himself. If it's any consolation, The Eldest repeatedly says that if HS had been more like college he'd have been a straight-A student. Will your eldest consider community college as an option to continue his education?
Dang, it makes me angry to hear about kids slipping through the cracks this way! My hope is that there's a different path for your younger one that allows him to be a boy, be active, be bright, and come out of school loving to learn.
Let's keep trying to figure it out!
DnW
Cary
· 3 years ago
Pardon me; brevity is not my favorite medium. I think the problem is not simple, but it is important to begin to focus on the causes.
1. Society will not deal with the divorce epidemic.
2. Most women/girls misinterpret feminism as resentment of all things male.
3. Custody of boys in a divorce is awarded to moms.
My parents divorced when I was five. I was raised by my mother and older sister, two man-haters (I am male). My mother had a master's degree in social work. She spent years as a family counselor, but she was an atrocious mother and ours was a ridiculously dysfunctional family.
Do not look to those with advanced degrees to solve this. They think an advanced degree is a license to digress and ignore. Do not look to women imbued with the anti-male trend of the last thirty years (such as the author of the Newsweek article).
The teacher who erroneously awarded your son an 'F' was a closet man-hater. You cannot afford to entrust your male children to such bigots. I was raised by two such, both of whom were blood-related, and we have not spoken in more than a decade. Their hatred of men means more to them than anything else.
mr.angel
· 3 years ago
IT just might be hint there could be gender bias in schools there deffinatly more female teachers most of school workers with the exception of janitors are women, ADHD is a sick joke it does not exsist its major problem with boys in school, They tried to say I had it when I was in school, but the school guidence counsler gave my parents the ADHD test that they gave the teachers, if you were ever to read this thing you would laugh, I still have it somewere its a checklist of common behavior like figits , stares off etc. they check off the boxes for each one they see the kid doing, they give the test to several teachers and then they average all the results, Then if you fail test you would have to take the drugs, I guess, Two of the teachers flat lied on the test many times too by the way and the guidence counsler pointed that out she had me as student before she was a counsler, anyway ADHD is not real disase , or disorder or anything else like that, it does how ever get kids high and lot of them show up and behave just for that, and I know guys in there thirties that the school put on riddilen and snort it up there nose to this day, My advise to parents is dont let the school people fool you,they dont know any better than you and really the education ends in elementry school, the rest is just repition, and you can suceed in college with out ever going to high school, there should be more options for students to finish school when there ready to regardless of there age or grade if they have gained the knowledge they should be able to progress rather than be forced to repeat the same work they have been doing since the first grade till there 18 schools should just what they do best babysit
Ann Evans
· 3 years ago
Boys need a lot more input from good male role models whether it be teachers or male relatives. They need more positive encouragement and love and hugs that they would ever admit to. Be there for them ,listen be non judgemental and keep open the lines of communication.Iit would great if all schools have a zero tolerance on drugs and actively police it . Regardless boys need discipline and routine before they acquire self discipline.
Jane
· 3 years ago
Well written. I agree with you. My experience has proven that girls have a much easier route in high school than boys. Teachers do favor girls, quite simply because they're quieter, more patient, listen better. Girls are not dealing with testosterone. I have one daughter and one son, both in high school and in some cases with the same teachers. They both make good grades, although my daughter does better than my son -- why? Because teachers like her. It's that simple. She knows she is liked by the teachers. My son, on the other hand, knows that the teachers do not like him or the other boys in the class. How does he knows this? They tell the class. Teachers do not keep their feelings a secret. They're not the professionals they use to be. They do not take pride in their job or in their students. This is all from personal experience, and if I've offended any teachers, good! Maybe it will prompt you to reevaluate your teaching methods. If you are one of the rare exceptions, then please look at your co-workers and evaluate their teaching methods. My daughter will graduate in the top 2% of her class of 500. My son will graduate in the top 30% of his class. My daughter has been encouraged and petted. My son has been told that he and the rest of the boys should sit at the back of the class because the teacher finds it easier to teacher if she doesn't have the boys in her face. Tell me -- why is my son not doing as well as my daughter?
Sue
· 3 years ago
This is all sooo sad (however does make me feel better that I’m not alone)! I have 2 sons 8 & 6, both do have some trouble in school too – not to a bad extent but not near the experience that I had when I was in school! They are slow at learning to read & write & hate homework – would rather have an evening in their room without TV than do 30 minutes of homework (that turns into 2 hours). I have been married for 13 years & both of our parents were not divorced (rare I know) so I can’t blame that. We do both work a lot though & I can blame that!! My husband said school has never been made for boys & there’s nothing you can do for them but raise them the best you can with the best values that you can. He was all D’s & F’s until collage – then A’s & B’s – that is so crazy!! When I try & talk to the teachers they will not address the boy/girl thing & just try to address my students - but how can you do that without comparing students & boys & girls? So what is the right thing to do? Private school, military school, all boy school? I did want to try the meds but my husband refuses to. I do feel lost & hate this for my boys, I wish there was a quick fix (and still waiting for that magic diet pill too)!!! Any suggestions?? Soozr89@yahoo.com.
Liz
· 3 years ago
Reply to Cary, who said,
"Most women/girls misinterpret feminism as resentment of all things male."
No feminist I know has that bias.
I am sorry that you had such a lousy upbringing, but do not make the mistake of repeating your mother's errors in the other direction. Bias is bias is bias.
DrumsNWhistles said,
"Boys need lots of physical activity - Boys need to MOVE. And not just in a structured PE class. They need the time to run around, play hard, run some more, and play, particularly at the younger ages. Most boys will not sit still and many boys need to learn by physically manipulating objects, getting ‘under the hood’ so to speak."
You know what? Girls need that too. Maybe more girls that boys will be able to "get by" in the classroom without unstructured outdoor play, but they aren't at the optimum to learn, I tell you that. Girls too learn by physical manipulation. My daughter's middle school was project-based and the girls learned more and faster with manipulation than mere recitation.
The "boy gap" has been around for a while. Here are some links to my blog that will take you to some thinkers on good education:
The current school model doesn't teach the majority well.
drumsnwhistles
· 3 years ago
Wow, there's some terrific comments here! Thank you all so much for contributing to this!
Liz:
Yes, you're absolutely right about girls too. What I see, though, is girls developing coping skills and ways around that need for movement and exercise, while the boys tend to act it out more. I think this is partly gender-based and tends to be less true as they get older. I'm a talker -- I have to speak things to understand them. As a result, I was constantly written up in school for being unable to control my talking. Especially elementary school. My way of coping with it was to learn to speak by writing. That was something acceptable that still accomplished the goal. I didn't realize it at the time, but it was my way of avoiding the criticism for not "avoiding needless talking".
And thank you for the nomination and kind words -- that's really an honor. :)
Sue:
You are most definitely not alone. Definitely. I don't know what to tell you about the meds except that it is really important that before they're prescribed both parents be fully educated and in accord, and the diagnosis be made by a psychiatrist or psychologist who has training and experience treating kids with ADHD. Honestly, the meds gave Sticks the ability to make the effort. The achievement has nothing to do with the meds beyond actually allowing him to focus enough to learn. His ADHD diagnosis rose out of our concerns for him, not teacher referrals. Teachers can be good resources but can't be the only resource. By the same token, I'd like to think that as parents, we'll consider all of the alternatives for our kids, including medications. We certainly wouldn't refuse insulin for diabetics or antibiotics for meningitis, so why do we rule out meds for ADHD out of hand without giving at least due consideration to them?
Read Liz' blog for some help with options for your boys. She's got tons of links and resources that might help you think through alternatives for your children. (Ahhhh, I feel another post coming on about all this....)
Jane,
Wow, you've got the proof right there. I wonder if your experiences with teachers being less professional has something to do with the low regard they get when it comes to pay and working conditions? Seriously, I think if we (society/taxpayers) treated them with more respect there would be more coming back. I can't tell you how much it bugs me to see teachers have to spend time groveling around for extra copy paper and classroom supplies. Shouldn't that be a slam-dunk? Grrrrr.
Cary:
What Liz said -- don't let resentment toward your mom color your attitude toward us all. Many women love boys and men -- I'm one. I had much more difficulty adjusting to the idea of parenting a daughter than just about anything, because girls leave me flummoxed half the time. (and I don't hate them either; just have more trouble understanding them...)
mr angel
ADHD is real. It's not always accurately diagnosed and can definitely be a catch-all, but I assure you that parents, teachers and doctors are not engaged in a grand conspiracy to drug the next generation. It's a very real disorder that disrupts many lives.
Ann Evans
Excellent points -- structure is a big part of helping boys to develop those critical life skills. Is single-sex education the answer? I don't know...still mulling that one over. What do you think?
All Comments
I have twin boys who are 8 yo, and one of them is exactly the same as the oldest. My dream would be to be able to stay at home and teach them myself, but that it impossible. I will continue searching for resources to help him through this new academic hell.
I'm sorry to hear you're having these struggles...my heart is right there with you. And like you, there is no way I could homeschool -- I used to really wish I could have in the earlier years.
I hope your son isn't so completely sour on learning that he gives up on himself. If it's any consolation, The Eldest repeatedly says that if HS had been more like college he'd have been a straight-A student. Will your eldest consider community college as an option to continue his education?
Dang, it makes me angry to hear about kids slipping through the cracks this way! My hope is that there's a different path for your younger one that allows him to be a boy, be active, be bright, and come out of school loving to learn.
Let's keep trying to figure it out!
DnW
1. Society will not deal with the divorce epidemic.
2. Most women/girls misinterpret feminism as resentment of all things male.
3. Custody of boys in a divorce is awarded to moms.
My parents divorced when I was five. I was raised by my mother and older sister, two man-haters (I am male). My mother had a master's degree in social work. She spent years as a family counselor, but she was an atrocious mother and ours was a ridiculously dysfunctional family.
Do not look to those with advanced degrees to solve this. They think an advanced degree is a license to digress and ignore. Do not look to women imbued with the anti-male trend of the last thirty years (such as the author of the Newsweek article).
The teacher who erroneously awarded your son an 'F' was a closet man-hater. You cannot afford to entrust your male children to such bigots. I was raised by two such, both of whom were blood-related, and we have not spoken in more than a decade. Their hatred of men means more to them than anything else.
"Most women/girls misinterpret feminism as resentment of all things male."
No feminist I know has that bias.
I am sorry that you had such a lousy upbringing, but do not make the mistake of repeating your mother's errors in the other direction. Bias is bias is bias.
DrumsNWhistles said,
"Boys need lots of physical activity - Boys need to MOVE. And not just in a structured PE class. They need the time to run around, play hard, run some more, and play, particularly at the younger ages. Most boys will not sit still and many boys need to learn by physically manipulating objects, getting ‘under the hood’ so to speak."
You know what? Girls need that too. Maybe more girls that boys will be able to "get by" in the classroom without unstructured outdoor play, but they aren't at the optimum to learn, I tell you that. Girls too learn by physical manipulation. My daughter's middle school was project-based and the girls learned more and faster with manipulation than mere recitation.
The "boy gap" has been around for a while. Here are some links to my blog that will take you to some thinkers on good education:
Boys and School (December 2005)
post that has links to Rick Montgomery's series, Raising Boys Better
national organization for single-sex education
The current school model doesn't teach the majority well.
Liz:
Yes, you're absolutely right about girls too. What I see, though, is girls developing coping skills and ways around that need for movement and exercise, while the boys tend to act it out more. I think this is partly gender-based and tends to be less true as they get older. I'm a talker -- I have to speak things to understand them. As a result, I was constantly written up in school for being unable to control my talking. Especially elementary school. My way of coping with it was to learn to speak by writing. That was something acceptable that still accomplished the goal. I didn't realize it at the time, but it was my way of avoiding the criticism for not "avoiding needless talking".
And thank you for the nomination and kind words -- that's really an honor. :)
Sue:
You are most definitely not alone. Definitely. I don't know what to tell you about the meds except that it is really important that before they're prescribed both parents be fully educated and in accord, and the diagnosis be made by a psychiatrist or psychologist who has training and experience treating kids with ADHD. Honestly, the meds gave Sticks the ability to make the effort. The achievement has nothing to do with the meds beyond actually allowing him to focus enough to learn. His ADHD diagnosis rose out of our concerns for him, not teacher referrals. Teachers can be good resources but can't be the only resource. By the same token, I'd like to think that as parents, we'll consider all of the alternatives for our kids, including medications. We certainly wouldn't refuse insulin for diabetics or antibiotics for meningitis, so why do we rule out meds for ADHD out of hand without giving at least due consideration to them?
Read Liz' blog for some help with options for your boys. She's got tons of links and resources that might help you think through alternatives for your children. (Ahhhh, I feel another post coming on about all this....)
Jane,
Wow, you've got the proof right there. I wonder if your experiences with teachers being less professional has something to do with the low regard they get when it comes to pay and working conditions? Seriously, I think if we (society/taxpayers) treated them with more respect there would be more coming back. I can't tell you how much it bugs me to see teachers have to spend time groveling around for extra copy paper and classroom supplies. Shouldn't that be a slam-dunk? Grrrrr.
Cary:
What Liz said -- don't let resentment toward your mom color your attitude toward us all. Many women love boys and men -- I'm one. I had much more difficulty adjusting to the idea of parenting a daughter than just about anything, because girls leave me flummoxed half the time. (and I don't hate them either; just have more trouble understanding them...)
mr angel
ADHD is real. It's not always accurately diagnosed and can definitely be a catch-all, but I assure you that parents, teachers and doctors are not engaged in a grand conspiracy to drug the next generation. It's a very real disorder that disrupts many lives.
Ann Evans
Excellent points -- structure is a big part of helping boys to develop those critical life skills. Is single-sex education the answer? I don't know...still mulling that one over. What do you think?